Podcast Episode 39. Navigating the Decision to go No-Contact

Link to Spotify

In this episode:

As we navigate the ups and downs of personal relationships, deciding to go no-contact with someone can be challenging. I discuss factors to consider before making this decision. In this episode, we’re digging into what might happen if you choose this path – the freedom it could bring and, possibly, the regret.

Resources:

Bottomless to Sober – Coaching, Classes, and Workshops

Transcript:
Hey, everyone, on today’s episode I wanted to talk about the idea of going no contact with people, specifically family members. This came up recently in a conversation with a one-on-one coaching client, because we talked about the fact that I have a brother that I’m basically no contact with, and so we talked a little bit about my decision to go no contact and I thought that it would actually be helpful to talk about that here and also kind of give you all a framework for which to help you think about this really incredibly difficult and personal decision. So, in my case, there were a lot of expectations that I felt that my brother placed on me. To give you context, right, let’s do a little bit of a backstory. We have a 17-year age gap. We were not raised in the same home. He is my mother’s son, not my father’s, and so by the time I was growing up, I was never around him. He was in the military and once he married and had children, I never really was around those nieces specifically my niece and then my sister who I was raised with and you have all heard me talk about her on this podcast. We did grow up together. She was basically like a third parental figure. As she grew, got married and had children, I was already kind of in close proximity to her children or, with her being so much older than me because she wanted me to be around her, she would take it upon herself to fly me out as a kid to go spend and stay the summer with her.

02:00
And so early on there was this investment in the relationship with me for my sister’s part, that I did not necessarily have with my brother and I didn’t think critically of it at all until adulthood, when several issues came up where I was held to an expectation that I wasn’t aware existed. And when I was in my 20s it really bothered me when I felt like I was not doing the right things as a sister. I felt like there were times that I felt short of a standard that was set for me but that I had never consented to, and it wasn’t really until I got sober that I realized that. Oh wait, I’m trying really hard or I’m stressing myself over meeting these relationship expectations that replaced on me that I never agreed to and I’m just going to opt out. And I mean, there’s so much more detail to add to that, which you’re more than welcome to reach out and invite me to have a personal conversation. I’d be happy to flush things out with you if you’re really curious about your situation. But that’s overall what it was, that I was entered into an agreement or an expectation for how I should be acting as a sister when I realized that the only thing we have in common is a common mother, and that was really it. And so I realized with my sobriety that I could not continue to invest in a relationship where I did not agree to the expectations that were being put on me, and so, essentially, we have pretty much gone no contact since then.

03:47
Anyway, the point is is that when you make a decision like that, right, you have to really slow down and think about what. Could the future outcomes be right? Deciding to go no contact with a person is not an impulsive decision that you just make in the heat of an argument, in the heat of the moment. It’s a decision that you make because you realize that this person is not contributing to your life in any way. That’s positive, and, if anything, they are depleting, right, they’re taking away from your life. I mean there’s general circumstances where going no contact would make sense, right? I mean just to kind of name a few. Obviously, if someone is abusive to you, if someone is incredibly toxic towards you, right, like, if they’re being emotionally manipulative, if they are engaging in toxic behavior that is harmful to your wellbeing, you might need to distance yourself, right.

04:48
And again, I have examples of things like that that I went through, that I realized that I was again driving myself crazy, worrying about meeting these expectations that were placed on me that didn’t resonate with me, I didn’t agree to. Or you might have an example of someone who’s, like, repeatedly violating your boundaries. Right, that can be problematic as well, because if you have communicated clearly to a family member what your limits are and they continue to disregard those limits and ignore your needs and ignore what you need to be at peace and happy, that may be a sign that you need to go to no contact. But again, when I say that they’re repeatedly violating your boundaries, a super important question for you to ask yourself is have I actually set them, or is it a boundary that’s in your head that has never been communicated. Because, I always say this, people are not mind readers, so you have to make sure that folks know exactly what your limits are.

05:52
Now let’s see if let’s go into the next part. You might have a family member who is setting off issues of, like, unresolved trauma. Right, if you’re interacting with a family member and you are going into some sort of flashback mode, right, that your mental health is actually negatively being impacted because suddenly you, you are stuck in a trauma response. Right, like you are a flight, right or not right, fight, flight, breeze or fawn. Right, that may be a sign that you might need some distance. Because, also, a sign that you probably need to see a licensed mental health professional. Right, because you’ve got to focus on some healing and sobriety.

06:33
Right, if you are struggling with your own addiction issues and you have a family member who is not supporting your need for sobriety, that can be a sign that you might need to create a boundary and create some distance between you and this family member, right. But again, what I always tell people is have you expressed to this family member how they can support you? Because if you haven’t given them the opportunity to support you properly, how do they know right. So, again, some of these things really do depend on your own communication, like you need to be making sure that you’re verbalizing to your family member exactly what you’re needing or not needing, what you want and don’t want, and if they’re not showing up for you in how you’re explicitly saying so, then yes, by all means feel free to go ahead and create that distance. If you have a family member that you’re always fighting with, I mean, you know it’s fair to create that distance, right? What is there to be gained from living a life of constant conflict with someone? It’s not good for your nervous system, it’s not good for your body, it’s not good for your relationships to constantly be in these back and forth situations. And for what right? There’s nothing to be gained there. So if you really cannot resolve these issues, if you have maybe brought it to like a neutral third party, like a counselor, a family counselor, and there’s still no progress there, that may be a cause to go no contact.

08:00
If you have had someone who is like, repeatedly betraying you, right, let’s say it’s somebody. I had someone one time who had a sister that kept trying to flirt with the different people that she would date, right, and it’s like the first time that it happened, not okay, but they had the conversation and again that limit, that boundary was set that if I’m bringing a guy home, I expect you to talk to him professionally or not professionally, but, you know, amicably but not flirtatiously and the sister continued to violate that. So you know what? There was a need for some space there and ultimately, even in some cases, right Like, there might be some just straight up, irreparable differences between you and a family member that if you are not able to sit peacefully with them at, like, the dinner table because of these differences, it may be worth considering creating some space.

08:55
However, so, now that we’ve kind of talked through these, there’s a couple of things that are super important for you to consider before you cut someone out of your life. Like I said, it has to be a very carefully thought out decision. Because I say this if, in the future, something were to happen to that individual, right, let’s say that person is no longer alive you are going to have to be able to be at peace with the fact that your relationship with that person ended well before their departure from this planet, right Like if you hear news that this person has departed, are you going to be okay looking at yourself in the mirror and recognizing that you decided to stop talking to this individual? If the answer is yes, then that gives you your answer right. But if you know that you would not be able to live with yourself, then you might need to reconsider going no contact before you end up doing something that’s going to be a massive source of regret for yourself and self anger right. But if, down the line, you’re stuck in a position where you are needing some sort of support, are you okay with never going to this person for support whether it be emotional support or financial support right. Are you okay with completely cutting that tie off? For some people, they absolutely are, and for others, they realize that that is not a bridge that they are quite ready to burn, and so these are incredibly important things to consider.

10:39
Anytime that I have made the decision to go no contact because I’ve done it with several people in my life I have made peace with the fact that if something were to happen to them tomorrow, I would be okay with what our relationship Looked like or didn’t look like, because it’s ended right, and I also made peace with the fact that I know that I could be literally on fire and and I will not go to them to ask them to toss a bucket of water on me, right?

11:10
And so it’s so important to have that clarity, and this is such a heavy and difficult decision that I I never recommend for anyone to take it lightly, right? And so, again, whether it’s that you are consulting with trusted people whose advice is Sound advice, whether you are working with a licensed mental health professional, whether you are working with a coach I am a live coach you can schedule a consultation with me, right? Whoever you are working with, make sure that they Are a non-biased third-party person to really help you navigate that conversation, because going no contact can be a great source of freedom or it can be a massive source of regret, and this life is hard enough. We don’t need to be living adding regrets to our daily experiences. So, with that, thanks so much for listening this week and I will catch you next time.

12:07
Hey, if you are enjoying what you are listening to, I invite you to subscribe and share the podcast, but also go to my website, bottomless, to sober calm and find out other opportunities to work with me, from free workshops to Writing classes to one-to-one life coaching opportunities. You can schedule a free consultation for that. Everything is available at bottomless to sober calm. See you then.


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Embracing Hope in Sobriety

Though sobriety doesn’t shield us from life’s challenges, nurturing hope empowers us with the resilience needed to navigate whatever adversity we face.

In an interview for Time Magazine, researcher and psychologist Chan Hellman defined hope as “the belief or the expectation that the future can be better, and that more importantly, we have the capacity to pursue that future.” In sobriety, this belief becomes a lifeline for those grappling with addiction, giving them something to hold onto while working to release their substance of choice.

As my relationship with drinking drew to a close, though I didn’t know exactly what to expect from a life without alcohol, I remember thinking that not drinking had to be better than this. At that juncture, my body was shutting down because of alcoholic liver disease—the idea of continuing to live desperately latched onto a substance that made me lie, sneak, and avoid consciousness felt equivalent to condemning myself to a living hell with a hopeless future.

Understanding that whatever sobriety had to offer me would be better than what my life was like in active addiction helped propel me into recovery. Hope empowered me to give up my career, surrender my home, and expose my secret struggle to the world—to reveal that I, the state teacher of the year, battled alcohol addiction. This surrender was based on the trust that doing these things would help me let go of the bottle I was drowning myself in. 

Even now, years into this sobriety journey, I still need to hold onto hope because it provides a profound assurance that challenging times won’t last. When I experienced my heart-breaking pregnancy loss, one of the most brutal blows in my recent history, I confronted a pivotal choice—believe in a brighter future or turn to apathy.

I believe my future will be better, not because it’s contingent on specific outcomes, such as a successful pregnancy, but because I’ve honed the skill of real self-care. I have a lot of heart and love to pour into myself and others, and I won’t let the hurt I feel harden my heart and turn me into an apathetic person.

In Brené Brown’s words, “The brokenhearted are the bravest among us. They had the courage to love.” I choose to embody this bravery, leaning on hope as one of my pillars of strength.

About the author, Jessica:

  • Jessica Dueñas, Ed.S., the founder of Bottomless to Sober and 2019 Kentucky State Teacher of the Year, is an educator in recovery who provides coaching services to individuals needing support in accomplishing their goals. In addition, Jessica facilitates professional development for organizations on wellness, leads workshops on writing and wellness, and is also available as a speaker for events.
  • In 2021, Jessica was named a Kentucky Colonel, the highest honor a civilian can receive in the state of Kentucky, for her service work in education and recovery spaces.
  • Read more about working with Jessica, including testimonials here.

Upcoming Opportunities:

Life Coaching Schedule a free coaching consultation here.

The Body Keeps the Score Book Study. Register here.

Free Writing for Healing WorkshopAccess here.

Podcast Listen to the Bottomless to Sober Podcast. Episodes 1-38 are live!

Podcast Episode 38. Navigating Recovery Using The Four Agreements

Link to Spotify

In this episode:

Navigating the complex emotions of recovery is no small feat, yet understanding the principles of Don Miguel Ruiz’s The Four Agreements gives us tools to foster peace, self-compassion and clarity. This episode is a testament to the healing potential of these agreements, especially within the framework of sobriety. 

Resources:

The Four Agreements by Don Miguel Ruiz

Bottomless to Sober – Coaching, Classes, and Workshops

Transcript:

00:17 – Jessica Dueñas (Host)
Hey everyone. So for today’s episode, I actually wanted to Don Miguel Ruiz, author of the four agreements. I’ve had a couple of people ask me recently, like Jessica, what were some of the books that were most impactful for you in your early recovery, and the four agreements was one of those books that really opened my eyes to just a lot of the different ways in which I was making myself really miserable and wanting to drink, and so I kind of wanted to do an overview of what the book discusses. I highly encourage anybody who has not read the book to go ahead and get the book. It’s a short read but it’s incredibly powerful and incredibly impactful and can really help you reflect on ways in which you are the own cause of like half of your own misery. Right, and it’s just a really empowering text. So again, domín Guérd-Ríces essentially he didn’t come up with these four agreements. If you read in the book and read more about him, he’s basically reflecting on ancient Toltec indigenous wisdom, and so these agreements are not necessarily his, but obviously he is credited with them because of the fact that he wrote the text. And so the four agreements are the following Number one be impeccable with your word. Number two don’t take anything personally. Number three don’t make assumptions. And number four always do your best. So first let’s talk about this recovery journey and agreement number one, which is be impeccable with your word, which, to summarize, really it’s about excuse me for coughing, because I have this cough that has not gone away, so you’re going to hear me cough on occasion, and if you don’t like it, you’re more than welcome to skip this episode. But being impeccable with your word speaks to speaking with integrity right and really speaking what you mean. Also, it speaks to avoiding gossip and self-destructive speech right and really.

02:11
The big emphasis here is to speak with truth and kindness. I want to emphasize that being honest does not mean being brutal, and there are times where people think that, because they tell it how it is and they just keep it real, that they think that they’re doing some sort of noble act of practicing honesty. You can speak truth without being cruel, and so the example that comes up in the book that I’m going to share with you in a second is a perfect example of somebody speaking how they felt, but it wasn’t honest, it wasn’t true and it wasn’t kind and then it had a negative ripple effect, right? So if you have the book and you go to pages 34 to 35, there is a story of a woman who was intelligent, had a great heart and she had a daughter that she loved. But basically she had a hard day at work. And she comes home and her daughter is singing right, but mom’s got this terrible headache, she’s exhausted and she really just wants peace and quiet in the home. Right, but her daughter is like singing and excited, because that’s what kids do. And at one point her mom just snaps at her and basically I’m paraphrasing from the book right, but the mom basically shouts at her and is like stop singing, you sound terrible. No, she didn’t sound terrible. What mom had was the headache, right, what mom was was exhausted, but mom didn’t communicate her need effectively and what impacted her words have, right, the power of her word, which the author talks about was that it really basically crushed that daughter. Do you think that that little girl ever sang again? According to the text, she never sang again. Right, and so you’re like, just what does this have to do with sobriety, again, a lot of sobriety, especially because we talk about how community is the opposite of addiction, right, we often hear that in a lot of different spaces that you all might be in, and I say that because you have to be mindful of how you speak to other people. When you embark on this recovery journey, you are going to find other people who are struggling sometimes, and the way that you treat them, though, it’s their choice, how they take your words and act on it, but the truth is we do impact others, and so when we are in recovery, right, speaking kindness, speaking truth, pausing before we speak, can have a great impact.

04:38
Another really important point that is brought up in this chapter is avoiding gossip. When you’re in recovery, a lot of the time, you are going to be joining different communities, right, so you may be participating in different meetings, and it’s going to be so important for you to not engage in shit talking right Like there that maybe an old habit and so many of us will thrive off of, like the feeling that rushes through our bodies when there’s gossip being talked about. However, the author argues that basically talking about gossip is like ingesting poison, in a sense, and then you get wrapped up in uncomfortable conversations, you get accused of things, and then suddenly you’re feeling uncomfortable showing up to a specific meeting that you previously enjoyed because you participated in gossip right, and therefore now you have a risk or something threatening your recovery because now there’s a meeting that you don’t want to go to anymore. So, again, if you are starting to see people engage in conversations that are not healthy, if you are starting to see people in your recovery space engage in yeah, gossiping, shit talking, however you want to call it, feel free to call them out on it or feel free to remove yourself from the situation. You don’t need to engage in gossip in order to be a part of right. Those are old behaviors that we may have engaged in. Those are old behaviors that we probably learned, especially in like elementary, middle school, high school, right To create a sense of belonging, let’s, let’s belong to each other by shitting on someone else, but that’s really not helpful. And so, again, being mindful of your language and the language that you allow yourself to surround yourself with is going to be imperative to your recovery. So that’s kind of like my version of being impeccable with your word.

06:27
So the next agreement excuse me, is the second agreement. Don’t take anything personally, and I want to say that between agreement two and agreement three, don’t make assumptions. Those to me are like the cornerstone of my mind being blown in early recovery and being like whoa, I don’t have to take things personally. That completely blew my mind right as a concept and so to essentially kind of paraphrase what this agreement means, it’s basically saying that whatever other people do, be it their actions or the words that they say, they’re a reflection of the reality that that individual is in and it’s never a personal attack. Even if it’s directly said to you right now in your face, it still has nothing to do with you and everything to do with that individual who is taking those actions or saying those words.

07:19
Right, by you not internalizing any external event and taking it personally, you can really free yourself from a lot of unnecessary suffering and really experience some emotional balance, which, of course, is going to help you with a recovery journey. Right, like if you can see things falling apart, if you can turn on the news and see politics and not take it personally, if you can have a bad interaction with someone in a meeting and realize you know what that person’s probably going through something that can be incredibly freeing to you and really help you with that urge to drink or numb in however other way. You might do that Right, freeing yourself from taking things personally really allows you to focus on your own happiness and growth. Right, again, when you can recognize that others actions are a reflection of them and their experiences and it’s not a judgment on you, it’s not a reflection on your worth. This can really just help you reduce that risk of feeling discouraged or overwhelmed when things are going wrong. And again, I’m talking on both like a micro level, like on individual levels, with your colleagues, your family members, your friends, people that you are in recovery with, and support groups. But I also mean you know it’s an election year here in the United States. So, however you feel about politics, I really want you to take this agreement and apply it to society as a whole. Right, don’t take things personally when people make laws that don’t resonate with you, when public figures speak things that hurt. Don’t take it personally, and that can be huge in helping you stay sober when the world feels like it’s falling apart. Okay, so just a couple of things that popped up in the text, right, I would totally recommend in the book, reading pages 53 and 54.

09:21
But here’s a couple of quotes that I pulled just to kind of share with you. So the first one, in terms of not taking things personally, is if they tell you how wonderful you are, they’re not saying that because of you. You know you’re wonderful. It’s not necessary to believe other people who tell you that you are wonderful. So I like this one, right, because it’s kind of twisting. It’s like well, why can’t I take a compliment? I mean, of course you can always be gracious and take a compliment, but again, right, whether it’s external validation or external stress, if we are the ones who determine our state of, like, mental balance, then we’re not getting super thrown off when people give us some indelible compliments, but we’re also not getting thrown off when people attack us or say things that hurt us, right?

10:08
The next comment that I pulled, or quote that I pulled from this section is don’t take anything personally. Even if someone got a gun and shot you in the head, it was nothing personal, even at that extreme. And I know that example can be wild and people will be like what the hell is this author talking about? If someone shoots me, of course it’s because it’s me. No, again, if you look at people who become violent, it’s usually something having to do with them is what the author would be arguing, right, and so when people talk badly about you, when people betray you, when people backstab you, a great example that I would say I see a lot say with like clients and one-on-one support is like, if their partner has been unfaithful, right, at the end of the day, a partner being unfaithful has everything to do with them and nothing to do with you. They’re the ones making that choice.

11:03
The last point that I loved from this chapter is even the opinions you have about yourself are not necessarily true. Therefore, you don’t need to take whatever you hear in your own mind personally. And again, this is super important in recovery, because in recovery, especially early on, we might be coming into this work with extremely low self-worth, right, we might feel horrible about ourselves, we might be still carrying a lot of shame, and so it’s important to recognize that those stories that we’re telling ourselves about ourselves are not always true, right, and so question your thoughts. A Cartoli in the Power of Now. He talks about looking at the thinker, right. So this is where you can give yourself the gift of separating yourself from your thoughts and recognizing that just because it’s a thought that’s in your mind doesn’t mean that it’s true and you can get curious about it. What is it trying to tell you? But you can recognize that it’s not necessarily true.

12:00
So, moving on to the next agreement is the third one. Don’t make assumptions, and it’s usually followed up with ask questions right, and this one you know. To basically paraphrase it is see clarity in your communication with others by asking questions right. Avoid misunderstandings by communicating openly and honestly. Don’t sit there and be pissed off at somebody who didn’t call and check in on you if you never expressed the need that you want to be checked in on right. People are not mind readers, and that is something that is so important with this agreement that if you are getting upset and you are finding yourself resentful towards somebody because they fell short of your expectation, here’s the question Did you communicate that expectation to them or did you just expect them to suddenly have common sense and show up for you? Because, again, people don’t have common sense. People don’t read minds. So it’s our job to make sure that the people that we need to show up for us know how to right. But again, when it’s in the case of receiving communication from other people, if you are not sure, it is absolutely your job to ask questions right. It is absolutely your job to seek a decrease in misunderstanding by getting curious right.

13:27
In the context of sobriety, avoiding making assumptions can really, really help you because if you are clear between you and another person, or you and your group right, then you can have clear expectations, you are able to not be confused about what to expect from other people and then again you’re giving yourself that opportunity to experience peace because you know exactly where people stand on things. You know that you have communicated where you stand on things. When you’re leaving things up in the air because of poor communication, you’re creating the space for conflict, you’re creating the space to feel let down, you’re creating the space to feel resentful and, of course, for someone who is still struggling with their substance use, whether it’s alcohol or other things, when we set that up, we’re going to want to drink right, we’re going to want to numb if we have all this turbulence between us and others because of miscommunication. So that clear communication is important and, yes, it takes a lot of courage to ask questions because sometimes you might hear what you don’t want to hear. Right? Let’s say that you’re dating someone and it’s kind of going into that little you know that term situation which is you’re acting like a relationship but it’s not officially one. Sometimes you don’t want to ask the question what are we? Right, because you might hear what you don’t want to hear. But giving yourself the opportunity to hear what you don’t want to hear gives you the clarity to decide if you want to stay in that ambiguous situation or if you want to break free from it because it’s not meeting your needs. Right, and so that gives you the opportunity to create space for what you want to receive that’s going to meet your needs. So super, super important to help you bring clarity into your life, to bring peace and opportunities for solid decision making, not making assumptions. Asking questions and making sure that you are communicating your needs directly to other people will absolutely set you up to be successful and find some peace. And I’ll pull this quote from the text he wrote if others tell us something, we make assumptions, and if they don’t tell us something, we make assumptions to fulfill our need to know and replace the need to communicate, even if we hear something and we don’t understand, we make assumptions about what it means and then believe the assumptions. We make all sorts of assumptions because we don’t have the courage to ask questions. We have agreed in our minds that it’s not safe to ask questions and we have agreed in our minds that if people love us they should know what we want or how we feel. But again, the people who love us are not mind readers and that is an incredibly unfair expectation to put on others. Have the courage to say what you want, have the courage to ask for what you need and if someone falls short of that, then use that as data to inform your next decisions about your relationship or connection with this individual.

16:23
Okay, moving on Agreement 4. Always do your best. So the fourth agreement always do your best is super important in the recovery journey because there’s a solid high correlation of people in recovery journeys who seek to do everything perfectly right, whether it’s I’ve got a streak of continuous sobriety where I’ve never slipped and never had a relapse. You know, there’s a lot of markers by which people measure success that could sometimes fall into that area of perfectionism which can be difficult for people to deal with. Right. And so the principle, the agreement of do your best recognizes that your best is going to look different every single day for every single individual. So if on Monday you got a good night’s sleep that night before you had a good breakfast, you didn’t have any conflict with anyone and maybe you go into your job and you have a solid day’s work, right, that’s your best that day. But maybe Monday night your child was sick and so you barely got sleep and then you got a flat tire on the way to work so you had like that stress on you. Your best on Tuesday is going to look absolutely different from Monday. But the point is that on Tuesday you try your best and whatever that actually ends up being, that is perfectly fine, right, that is absolutely acceptable because you recognize that best looks different every day. Best looks different from individual to individual, right? And then, when you know that you gave it your best that day, even if your best was just showing up and clocking in, right, maybe you didn’t work on any projects, but you showed up and that was the best you can do you can at least give yourself the peace of that day of knowing that you tried your best.

18:22
Drink thing with recovery, right, for someone who is working on quitting their drinking. Maybe in one month they did not drink for 29 days and one of those days in that month they had a slip and they had like a couple drinks and then they immediately got it back together and went back to being totally abstinent. Prior to that, they had been drinking every single day one or two bottles of wine. Right, let’s talk about how great they’re doing. Let’s celebrate the fact that they have made such a drastic improvement, right, and so giving it your best every single day is going to look different, and in a recovery journey, right, the key here is to focus on that continuous improvement.

19:04
Right, you hear in some spaces you’ll hear that term progress, not perfection, and that’s the important thing here to remember in our sobriety journey right, that in sobriety, it’s about giving our best effort. Every day we acknowledge progress and we have to be compassionate with ourselves during difficult times. As someone who took 14 months to finally stop drinking because I kept relapsing and getting hospitalized because of my extreme alcohol abuse right, if I had been able to practice compassion with myself, I may not have spun out of control as much as I did, but I believe that I was basically a failure for drinking again after a period of sobriety. So as soon as I had the first one, I would say you know what effort. And then I would drink until I had to be hospitalized, right. And so there’s a lot that compassion can do for you when you’re struggling.

19:58
And so, again, that always do your best piece is just so important, so important to a recovery, and so I wanted to pull a couple of quotes with regard to the fourth agreement, just to kind of share it with you. So I’m pulling first from pages 75 and 76. And so the author, dominique Ries. He wrote under any circumstances, always do your best, no more and no less. Keep in mind that your best is never going to be the same from one moment to the next. Everything is alive and changing all the time. So your best will sometimes be high quality and other times it will not be as good. When you wake up refreshed and energized in the morning, your best will be better than when you are tired at night. Your best will be different when you’re healthy as opposed to sick, or sober as opposed to drunk. Your best will depend on whether you are feeling wonderful and happy or upset, angry or jealous Right.

20:54
And then, on page 84 and 85, he shares this piece and he says we don’t need to know or prove anything. Just to be to take a risk and enjoy your life is all that matters. Say no when you want to say no and yes when you want to say yes. You have the right to be you and you can only be you when you do your best. When you don’t do your best, you’re denying yourself the right to be you Right. So give yourself that self-compassion and understand that sobriety is not a perfection journey and it should never be a perfection journey. Good for the people who make zero mistakes, but, to be honest, all of us fall short at some point or another of our different goals, and so it is absolutely okay to be a human, it is absolutely okay to be imperfect. And so with that I’ll just close out again.

21:56
I highly recommend reading the four agreements. I think that that will be a great read for anybody who is looking for something to read to help them with their sobriety. Quit Lit is great. A lot of people like it. I’m actually I’m not that into Quit Lit. I love more of the neuroscience than just general self-help books, and so I would say the four agreements, is a solid, self-help slash, personal development text that I highly encourage anyone to read at any point in their recovery journey, but especially early on when you have so many emotions trying to like hijack you. So, with that being said, thanks so much, and I will see you in the next one. Hey, if you are enjoying what you are listening to, I invite you to subscribe and share the podcast. But also go to my website, bottomlesstosober,com, and find out other opportunities to work with me, from free workshops to writing classes to one-to-one life coaching opportunities. You can schedule a free consultation for that. Everything is available at bottomlesstosober.com. See you then.


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Podcast Episode 37. Pregnancy Loss: What It Moved Me To Unlearn About Recovery

Link to Spotify

In this episode:
CW: pregnancy loss and death by overdose

This episode touches on the unlearning that happens when “doing the next right thing” is overshadowed by life’s most painful moments. I discuss how recovery has taught me to handle the hard things, including navigating a miscarriage—a topic often kept silent yet desperately needing a voice.

Resources:

Bottomless to Sober – Coaching, Writing Classes, and Workshops

Transcript:
Today’s episode is going to have a content warning specifically for conversations around pregnancy, loss and death by overdose, so if those are things that you do not want to hear about, then don’t listen to today’s episode. Otherwise, thank you for joining. So it’s my birthday, the time of this recording. It is Sunday, february 4th, and today is my 39th birthday, and normally I would be feeling more excited, but it has been a hell of a week and I’m honestly just living in a lot of pain right now, and two things can be true at once, right. So I am living with a lot of emotional pain right now, while I’m also experiencing a lot of gratitude for several things. I’m absolutely experiencing a ton of gratitude for how I have handled myself this week with the loss that I’ve been dealt, and I’m also really grateful for the people in my life who have shown up for me. I don’t think that I realized how loved I was until things started to go wrong this week and the amount of support that I have had on all sides, like from people at my day job to my colleagues at the luckiest club, to the people in my personal life, right Like I have really been so loved and supported and for that I am so grateful. But, anyway, what I wanted to do for today’s episode, I actually wanted to read the reflective piece that I wrote. I always like delivering content in different forms and I think, like some people are readers and then some people are listeners, and so for the folks who I connect with here on this world, who like to listen to the things that I share, this is really for you and I’ll probably, you know, add love a couple of things. But I did want to share this reflection because it means a lot to me in my journey that I was able to put this together. So I titled this piece when doing the next right thing wasn’t enough, and I hope that if you know anyone who has dealt with pregnancy loss themselves and especially is navigating the walk of recovery, I hope you’ll share it with them. I think a lot of people really don’t talk about miscarriage like at all, and it really does a disservice to folks when they go through it and they think that they’re the only ones right, and so I’m speaking up because I hope that this helps someone else feel a little bit less alone, and I also speak up because it helps me feel better to share. So, with that being said, here is this piece that I wrote this week when doing the next right thing wasn’t enough.

03:04
In the social media realm, sobriety related posts present enticing promises to people who might want to quit drinking from promises of glowing skin and better sleep to weight loss in the prospect of a life so fulfilling that the idea of escaping to drink seems unimaginable. Appealing as they are, such promises are only true sometimes, especially the ones about loving your life so much that you won’t want to escape it. In my early recovery, I subscribed to the belief that doing the next right thing would shield me from the unknown future, that getting my addiction under control would end my suffering. The bulk of my suffering was caused by drinking when, out of desperation for companionship, I found myself repeatedly entangled in relationships with men who feared commitment. When one of them did offer me commitment, it turned out that he struggled with opiate addiction and, ignoring it, I trusted that love alone would conquer it and, as no one likes to admit, love was not enough, while on the pain of the pandemic and the world being shut down, and he was driven back to the needle. I saw him for the last time, bluish, before the coroner wheeled him away, just before his relapse and death. We had talked about what it would look like to build a family. His rough, calloused hands carefully held my face as he gently whispered you are my family, and I shared with him that I wanted to have a baby. Not a week later, in what felt like an instant, he was gone. Instead of seeking help, I dove into every possible bottle to avoid the pain of losing him. My dreams of a family were shattered. I felt I would never find a partner, fall in love or become a mother. That year, isolation and grief landed me in eight alcohol-related hospitalizations that lasted from three days to five weeks.

05:07
When I finally got sober in November of 2020, I needed to believe that I had paid my dues of emotional suffering due to a life of alcohol addiction. I had to hold on to the hope that if I could stop pouring this poison into my body, that everything would go just right. Surely, sobriety would bring me peace in life. I would want to embrace, rather than escape, a belief I carried until recently. In December of 2023, I was in a new, healthy, long-term relationship and finally felt safe enough to consider actually trying to get pregnant.

05:46
On a chilly afternoon, I went to the grocery store and filled my cart with snacks, suddenly, strolling into the family planning section Like a teenage girl with a secret, I glanced around to make sure no one was watching and I snuck a box of pregnancy tests into my shopping cart. My stomach fluttered with excitement as the cashier rang up my total. Rushing home to use the bathroom, I ripped into the box and tore open the test packaging. A faint pink line came up, eyes wide, my chest tightened with anticipation as I pulled out another test and waited. I was pregnant. Grabbing the third test, I waited again, I was still pregnant. After years of not trusting myself or my partners, I rejoiced Finally, I get to be a mom.

06:39
On Christmas, I told my partner the news, the joy of which was the best gift I could give. Weeks later, we confirmed the pregnancy with an ultrasound and upon hearing the heartbeat, we beamed at each other and right with excitement. We shared the news with our loved ones and colleagues and I started to write notes to the baby in a collection of random thoughts titled All the Things I Wish I had Known. The joyous anticipation abruptly extinguished during a routine checkup on January 30th. The ultrasound delivered the heartbreaking news of a silent miscarriage. I’m so sorry, jessica. The sonographer said quietly the baby is gone. Looking at the screen, trying to make sense of her words, I listened for a heartbeat that was not there. On the screen was a misshapen sack. My heart sank, my eyes watered. My partner squeezed my hands tightly as the room spun out of control.

07:44
Despite my beliefs about recovery, life had shattered the illusion of sobriety as a shield against pain and loss. About one out of four pregnancies. Don’t make it, it’s not your fault. My doctor explained there’s no reason. As I wept silently in my partner’s arms tears in his eyes too my heart felt that familiar feeling of shattering and my thoughts raced. Will I ever become a mother? Do I have the courage to try to get pregnant again? What if I never become a mother? I’ve been through enough already. Why do I have to go through this? Haven’t I done all the right things?

08:30
That final thought right, that final reflection is precisely where I got things wrong about recovery and I had some serious unlearning to do you see, recovery? It’s not a guaranteed dispensary of desires earned through time and effort sobriety, it turns out. It doesn’t equal immunity from hardship, but rather it equips us with the tools to face life’s challenges. And in the face of this loss, I went ahead and I revisited a note that I had written to the baby. And the note said this difficult times come to reveal something about you to yourself, something that you would have never known otherwise. How could you know how strong you are if you never had something to overcome? Don’t seek hardships, but when they come, say hello. What are you here to teach me? Right, like here’s the thing Recovery. It doesn’t exempt us from life’s tribulations, but it does transform our ability to navigate them.

09:46
When I read that note and I contemplated this loss, I realized that I had to process the lesson that recovery owes me nothing. Right, it has armed me with the means to handle life’s challenges without needing to escape when my partner passed away in 2020, isolation and alcohol those were my coping mechanisms when I miscarried this week. I immediately leaned on others for support. I accepted offers of food and companionship, I took time off work, I cleared my calendar, except for one thing that I couldn’t figure out how to clear and I sought refuge with my sister after having surgery to complete the miscarriage. Like you know, on Tuesday I found out I was miscarrying and then I had to turn around and have surgery on Thursday. It was fast, right, but, simply put, I have allowed others to take care of me and I have changed the narrative of how I respond to hardship because of my recovery. And again, it’s my birthday weekend. Today is my actual birthday and I basically canceled the entire celebration, right, because of my broken heart. Like, I feel like shit. I don’t feel like being a social butterfly, and that’s okay, but you know what? I’m still choosing to stay sober and I’m choosing to sit with this inevitable pain that is coming with everything that’s happened this week.

11:11
During the support group meetings that I lead with the luckiest club, one of the things that we do is we always close out those meetings with a reading of the nine things. And so the nine things. If you’ve ever read Laura McCow and spoke, push off from here. She basically says that the nine things are exactly like what she has always needed to hear during her hardest times, right and so, and that these are things that she needs to hear. Excuse me for my cough, but these are the things that she needs to hear in her daily experience. Right, and I realize when I listen to the nine things it’s almost like they’re applicable beyond sobriety, because I feel like I need to hear these damn nine things to help me recover and start this process of healing from the miscarriage as well. And so I’ll go ahead and I’ll read the nine things they say.

11:58
One it is not your fault. Two it is your responsibility. Three it is unfair that this is your thing. Four this is your thing. Five this will never stop being your thing until you face it. Six you can’t do it alone. Seven only you can do it. Eight you are loved. And nine, we will never stop reminding you of these things.

12:30
And so, going back to that note right, that I had written to my unborn baby don’t seek the hardships, but when they come, say hello.

12:40
You know what are you here to teach me? Yeah, like hello, you fucking hard times. I’m not grateful for them, but I am thankful for how I have learned to handle them, and that is a true testament to my sobriety, right when I, when I met with my therapist yesterday, she brought up the point that in recovery journeys whether we’re recovering from different substances or behaviors, whatever we’re recovering from in this life because we’re all recovering from something that we go through phases of having to hold onto certain beliefs to get us through certain windows and then letting go of those beliefs. And so in the beginning of anyone’s sobriety journey, right, we have to latch onto that belief that sobriety is going to be this ticket to a happy, healthy, beautiful life. We’ve got to hold on to that because if there’s no hope in sobriety, then why the hell would we stop drinking?

13:42
But eventually, right, and I almost feel like this is my official transition from the early recovery into I don’t know, I don’t know what you call go beyond early recovery, regular recovery, long term recovery. But I think that this to me feels like it’s the big transition where I have finally let go of the pink cloud, right, like that’s definitely gone, and I absolutely recognize that I’m not immune from the pain of this human existence, but I get to handle it totally differently from how I would have handled it in my drinking days. And I think that that is the transition from early recovery into, like, the rest of recovery. And, who knows, like I might have other revelations in time but I really do kind of feel like that’s my big, big takeaway that in the beginning I needed to believe that everything was sunshine and rainbows. I needed to believe that you could have fun sober, and I needed to believe that sobriety was all this rah, rah, rah. And now I understand that sobriety isn’t all those things, and that’s okay. I don’t need to believe that anymore.

14:53
In order to stay sober, now I just know that sobriety equips me with the tools to handle whatever comes my way, and for that I’m grateful. And, like I said at the start of this, I’m also just really grateful for all the love that I have received. I don’t know if I’ll get to become a mom, right, like one in four pregnancies don’t make it, and that’s crazy that that’s not talked about enough, right, I’m getting older. Today is my 39th birthday, mind you. My mom had me at 45, so, and she had me naturally. So there’s hope, right, but I just don’t know, and I have to find and seek that radical acceptance that I just don’t know. I can only control what is in my control, what’s in my power, but these outcomes that I seek, they’re not, they’re out of my hands, right and it really hurts to face that reality.

15:53
So, anyway, thank you all so much for your time. Thank you for listening. It would mean the world to me if you shared this episode, or if you go to my site and share the blog entry. Share it with other folks who might need that support and, yeah, I will see you in the next episode. Take care, hey. If you are enjoying what you are listening to, I invite you to subscribe and share the podcast. But also go to my website, bottomlessdeseobercom, and find out other opportunities to work with me, from free workshops to writing classes, to one-to-one life coaching opportunities. You can schedule a free consultation for that. Everything is available at bottomlessdeseobercom. See you then.


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When Doing The Next Right Thing Wasn’t Enough

Content Warning: pregnancy loss, death by drug overdose

In the social media realm, sobriety-related posts present enticing promises to people who might want to quit drinking, from promises of glowing skin and better sleep to weight loss and the prospect of a life so fulfilling that the idea of escaping to drink seems unimaginable.

Appealing as they are, such promises are only true sometimes, especially the ones about loving your life so much that you won’t want to escape it.

In my early recovery, I subscribed to the belief that doing the “next right thing” would shield me from the unknown future, that getting my addiction under control would end my suffering.

The bulk of my suffering was caused by drinking, when, out of desperation for companionship, I found myself repeatedly entangled in relationships with men who feared commitment. When one of them did offer me commitment, it turned out that he struggled with opiate addiction. Ignoring it, I trusted that love alone would conquer it.

As no one likes to admit, love was not enough. Pile on the pain of the pandemic and the world being shut down, and he was driven back to the needle. I saw him for the last time, blueish, before the coroner wheeled him away. Just before his relapse and death, we had talked about what it would look like to build a family. His rough, calloused hands carefully held my face as he gently whispered, “You are my family,” and I shared with him that I wanted to have a baby. Not a week later, in what felt like an instant, he was gone.

Instead of seeking help, I dove into every possible bottle to avoid the pain of losing him. My dreams of a family were shattered. I felt I would never find a partner, fall in love, or become a mother.

That year, isolation and grief landed me in eight alcohol-related hospitalizations that lasted from three days to five weeks. When I finally got sober in November of 2020, I needed to believe that I had paid my dues of emotional suffering due to a life of alcohol addiction. I had to hold onto the hope that if I could stop pouring this poison into my body that everything would go just right. Surely, sobriety would bring me peace and a life I would want to embrace rather than escape, a belief that I carried until recently.

In December of 2023, I was in a new, healthy, long-term relationship and finally felt safe enough to consider actually trying to get pregnant.

On a chilly afternoon, I went to the grocery store and filled my cart with snacks, suddenly strolling into the family planning section. Like a teenage girl with a secret, I glanced around to make sure no one was watching, and I snuck a box of pregnancy tests into my shopping cart. My stomach fluttered with excitement as the cashier rang up my total. Rushing home to use the bathroom, I ripped into the box and tore open the test packaging.

A faint pink line came up.

Eyes wide, my chest tightened with anticipation as I pulled out another test and waited.

I was pregnant.

Grabbing the third test, I waited again.

I was still pregnant.

After years of not trusting myself or my partners, I rejoiced!

Finally, I get to be a mom.

On Christmas, I told my partner the news, the joy of which was the best gift I could give. Weeks later, we confirmed the pregnancy with an ultrasound. Upon hearing the heartbeat, we beamed at each other, bright with excitement.

We shared the news with our loved ones and colleagues, and I started to write notes to the baby in a collection of random thoughts titled, “All The Things I Wish I Had Known.”

The joyous anticipation abruptly extinguished during a routine checkup on January 30th, 2024. The ultrasound delivered the heartbreaking news of a silent miscarriage. “I’m so sorry, Jessica,” the sonographer said quietly. “The baby is gone.” Looking at the screen, trying to make sense of her words, I listened for a heartbeat that was not there. On the screen was a misshapen sac. My heart sank. My eyes watered. My partner squeezed my hand tightly as the room spun out of control.

Despite my beliefs about recovery, life had shattered the illusion of sobriety as a shield against pain and loss.

About one out of four pregnancies don’t make it. “It’s not your fault,” my doctor explained. “There’s no reason.” As I wept silently in my partner’s arms, tears in his eyes, too, my heart felt the familiar feeling of shattering. My thoughts raced.

Will I ever become a mother?

Do I have the courage to try to get pregnant again?

What if I never become a mother?

I’ve been through enough already – why do I have to go through this?

Haven’t I done all the right things?

This final reflection is precisely where I got things wrong about recovery and had some serious unlearning to do.

Recovery, I learned, is not a guaranteed dispensary of desires earned through time and effort.

Sobriety, it turns out, does not equal immunity from hardship but rather equips us with the tools to face life’s challenges.

In the face of this loss, I revisited a note I had written to my unborn child.

After the initial pregnancy confirmation.

Difficult times come to reveal something about you to yourself,
Something that you would have never known otherwise.
How could you know how strong you are
If you never had something to overcome?
Don’t seek hardships, but when they come,
Say, “Hello. What are you here to teach me?”

Recovery doesn’t exempt us from life’s tribulations but transforms our ability to navigate them. Reading the note and contemplating this loss, I needed to process the lesson that recovery owes me nothing. It has armed me with the means to handle life’s challenges without needing to escape.

When my partner passed away in 2020, isolation and alcohol were my coping mechanisms. When I miscarried, I immediately leaned on others for support, accepting offers of food and companionship. I took time off of work, cleared my calendar, and sought refuge with my sister after having surgery to complete the miscarriage on February 1st. Simply put, I have allowed others to take care of me and changed the narrative of how I respond to hardship.

It’s my birthday weekend, and I canceled the celebration because of my broken heart. Still, I choose to stay sober and sit with the inevitable pain that comes with this past week’s events.

During group support meetings that I lead with The Luckiest Club, we always close with a reading of “The Nine Things” from Laura McKowen’s book, Push Off From Here. Laura says, “I wrote the nine most important things I needed to hear — from myself, from others, from what I understood to be God — when I was in the dark hell of my addiction. They were the things I still needed to hear daily in sobriety.” I needed to hear these things to recover from the miscarriage and gather myself to move forward:

  1. It is not your fault.
  2. It is your responsibility.
  3. It is unfair that this is your thing.
  4. This is your thing.
  5. This will never stop being your thing until you face it.
  6. You can’t do it alone.
  7. Only you can do it.
  8. You are loved.
  9. We will never stop reminding you of these things.

Hello, hard times.

While I am not grateful for them, I am thankful for how I have learned to handle them, a testament to the essence of my sobriety.

About the author, Jessica:

  • Jessica Dueñas, Ed.S., the founder of Bottomless to Sober and 2019 Kentucky State Teacher of the Year, is an educator in recovery who provides coaching services to individuals needing support in accomplishing their goals. In addition, Jessica facilitates professional development for organizations on wellness, leads workshops on writing and wellness, and is also available as a speaker for events.
  • In 2021, Jessica was named a Kentucky Colonel, the highest honor a civilian can receive in the state of Kentucky, for her service work in education and recovery spaces.
  • Read more about working with Jessica, including testimonials here.

Upcoming Opportunities:

Life Coaching Schedule a free coaching consultation here.

The Body Keeps the Score Book Study. Register here.

Free Writing for Healing WorkshopAccess here.

Podcast Listen to the Bottomless to Sober Podcast. Episodes 1-36 are live!